Episode 186: Brin-Jonathan Butler — Misfits, Status, and ‘Tourist Information’

By Brendan O’Meara

Good ol’ Brin-Jonathan Butler returns to the show. In years’ past, he’s come on to talk about all kinds of stuff. Cuba. Access as a drug. Chess. And the blessing of struggle.

He’s a kindred spirit and person who best articulates what I’m thinking, only I’m incapable of articulating it the way he can.

Brin’s also my favorite writer going. He throws a “heavy ball,” as we say in baseball circles. The ball sounds differently coming off his bat.

He’s the author of The Grandmaster and The Domino Diaries and he’s the host of the new podcast Tourist Information.

Be sure to subscribe to the podcast wherever you get your pods and to subscribe to my monthly newsletter. Social media is @CNFPod, though, as many of you know, I’ve scaled back quite a bit on this.

As always, thanks for listening.

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Episode 185: Tim O’Brien on Memory, Failure and his ‘Maybe Book’

By Brendan O’Meara

Tim O’Brien, the author of The Things They Carried and Going After Cacciato, has written a book sixteen years in the making: Dad’s Maybe Book (HMH, 2019).

I’m no dad, nor will I ever be one, but I’m a son, and I’d read about bricklaying if Tim O’Brien’s name is attached to it. This book is so expansive and tender and prescriptive without being didactic. It’s about reading, writing, fatherhood, sonhood, marriage, struggle, triumph, demons. It’s about Tim.

Remember, if you enjoy the show, consider linking up to it on social media and leaving a kind review over on Apple Podcasts.

And also be sure to sign up for my monthly newsletter. I’ve scaled back social media (@CNFPod across the Big Three), but the newsletter is the real thing, the real one-to-one connection I’m after.

Enjoy this conversation with Tim O’Brien.

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Episode 184: Kristina Gaddy — ‘Flowers in the Gutter’ and Loving What’s Underneath It All

Kristina Gaddy

By Brendan O’Meara

Hey, CNFers, Kristina Gaddy (@kgadz) is here to drop some sick riffs on the craft. She’s also here to talk about her new book Flowers in the Gutter: The True Story of the Teenagers Who Fought the Nazis. I know, right? So selfish.

This was a fun one as we dig into her reading habits, her writing routine, her obsession with that writing software, and her passion for research.

Be sure to sign up for my monthly newsletter, up there, down there, pop up.

What else? You can join the show on Instagram, Twitter, and Facebook.

Hey, there’s a services tab up there, but you can go there now. I’d be honored to help you with your work. It’s time to level up you work and I want to help.

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Happy 2020, CNFers

Happy 2020, CNFers!

You might be wondering, what the riff? Why isn’t there an interview in this slot right now?

Well, this happens, at times, when people cancel on me or miss their appointment and my scrambling to fill the time slot comes up empty. In the creative vaccum that is the time in and around Christmas and New Years, it’s often a losing battle.

My advice to you is, maybe check out some of the interviews that have accumulated in your feed. There’s no shortage. A new interview will be here next week with Kristina Gaddy, and we’ve got exciting ones coming down the pipeline with Tim O’Brien, Pamela Coloff and Rachel Aviv, just to name a few. 

Also, in my effort to better serve you, the listener, I’d love to know what I could be doing to better address your needs as a creator in this genre. Do you like the origin questions? Do you like the tactical stuff? Would you like things to stay the same? Am I hitting the right beats that make you energized about your own work? This podcast is for you. I make this for you. Without you there is no CNF. I want to make a show worth sharing and it’s only worth sharing if you are able to add those valuable insights to your cart and check out better for it. So please email the show creativenonfictionpodcast at gmail . com or brendan at brendanomeara . com with your insights. It doesn’t have to be long, but as the show enters its eighth year, I want to make sure I haven’t lost touch with the people who matter most: you.

But this is also a time for me to share a great quote from Charles Bukowski about writing and it goes to the heart of what I think it means to be a writer and an artist. 

He writes,

Too many writers write for the wrong reasons. They want to get famous or they want to get rich or they want to get laid by the girls with bluebells in their hair. When everything works best, it’s not because you chose writing but because writing chose you. It’s when you’re mad with it, it’s when it’s stuffed in your ears, your nostrils, under your fingernails. It’s when there’s no hope but that.

He goes on … then says:

It was cancer madness. And it was never work or planned or part of a school. It was. That’s all. We work too hard. We try too hard. Don’t try. Don’t work. It’s there. It’s been looking right at us, aching to kick out the closed womb. It’s all free, we needn’t be told. Classes? Classes are for asses. Writing a poem is as easy as beating your meat or drinking a bottle of beer.

So, as we approach this new year, maybe we don’t need to overthink it. We don’t need permission from anyone. We don’t need another online class from a “master” who, by the way, didn’t need an online class to do the work she’s so famous for. If we approach the work with generosity and rigor, and put our best word forward every time, then that’s the victory. 

When four guys in northern california got together and started playing heavy metal music, sure, they had dreams of going out on the road, but it always about the music in that garage. Those guys, give or take because one got booted out of the band and one died in a bus crash, made it because they had always made it.

We make it in this business when we decide. There’s no arrival. Malcolm Gladwell is jealous of Michael Lewis.

So, we make it when we decided to arrive. I hope you decide right now to own it. Own the title. Own your shitty work. It won’t be shitty for long.

I wish you the best arrival in 2020 and beyond. Let’s get after it this year.

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Episode 181: Amy Fish — Starting Late, Dealing with Rejections, and How to Get Someone to Clean Up After Their Dog

By Brendan O’Meara

Amy Fish is here to talk about her book I Wanted Fried With That (New World Library).

We talk about her approach to writing the book, revisiting old essays, dealing with the flood of rejections and the art of the crafty complaint.

We brought up her 100 rejections in a year manifesto, something she said at HippoCamp 2019, something she took from Lisa Romeo.

Amy talks about drawing inspiration from David Sedaris, Malcolm Gladwell, and the mystery genre.

Make sure you’re subscribed to the podcast (wherever!) and, more importantly, the monthly newsletter. You can subscribe at the form at the bottom of this post. You can subscribe by this link. Or you can put your name in the task bar at the very top of this web page. It’s that easy.

Thanks for listening, CNFers. It means the world to me. Seriously.

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Episode 179: John O’Connor — Finding Your Donkey

John O’Connor with horse.

By Brendan O’Meara

John O’Connor is here to talk about his essay “Everything Gets Worse,” Issue 32 of Creative Nonfiction’s True Story.

In this episode we talk about the genesis of this essay, what it says about him and finding a donkey for your story.

Towards the end, he also brings up Jenny Odell and wanting to read her book How to Do Nothing. You can listen to my conversation with Jenny if you’d like. No presh. You might also like Eric Ducker, who wrote a great profile on Jenny for The Ringer.

Support the show by linking up to it on your social platforms, engaging with the show on Twitter, IG or Facebook, and consider leaving a review or rating on Apple Podcasts. We’re real close to 100. Let’s get there and see what happens.

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Episode 177: Steven Moore — Essays About to Break, Keeping Track of the Positive, and ‘The Longer We Were There’

By Brendan O’Meara

Steven Moore is here to talk about his memoir The Longer We Were There: A Memoir of a Part-Time Soldier (University of Georgia Press, 2019).

It’s in my Top 3 Memoirs of the year. My faves were Meredith May’s The Honey Bus and Leslie Jamison’s The Recovering.

In any case, Steven and I randomly met in November 2018 in line at a talk during the Portland Book Festival. We were in line to hear Elizabeth Rush give a talk. He heard my voice from this thing and here we are.

You see? You never know where your next podcast guest might come from.

Thanks, of course, to Bay Path University’s MFA in Creative Nonfiction for the support. Check them out.

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Episode 175: Cassandra King Conroy — Mid-life Resurgence and Her Time with Pat Conroy in ‘Tell Me a Story’

Photo courtesy of Bold Life.

By Brendan O’Meara

Cassandra King Conroy is the author of several works of fiction and, most recently, the memoir Tell Me a Story: My Life with Pat Conroy.

Be sure to subscribe to the show and keep the conversation going on Twitter @CNFPod or @BrendanOMeara. I love to hear what resonates with you, so please reach out and certainly share across your networks.

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Episode 174: Bob Batchelor — Humble Beginnings, Breaking Free from Google, and ‘The Bourbon King

Bob Batchelor, author of The Bourbon King.

“These guys were screaming at me from beyond the grave.” —Bob Batchelor (@CultPopCulture)

“I worked to write the longest screenplay possible.” —Bob Batchelor

By Brendan O’Meara

Here we are again, CNFers! What’s new?

We’ve got Bob Batchelor here talking about The Bourbon King: The Life and Crimes of George Remus, Prohibition’s Evil Genius (Diversion Books)

Crazy story, a story that partly inspired The Great Gatsby, perhaps, maybe.

I hope you check it out.

We dig into lots of great things: How John Updike showed Bob the way, singing a kind of Pennsylvania song, and dealing with a real rotten teacher who made Bob’s life miserable until he got out from under her and made something of himself with mentors who saw his potential in college. It’s a great story.

Keep the conversation going on Twitter @CNFPod. And, if you’re feeling kind, leave a review on Apple Podcasts. I hope I’ve made something worth sharing, so please share it with your own network.

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A Riff on Success featuring AC Shilton

By Brendan O’Meara

To get over jealousy and the malicious feeling towards the other who always makes it feel like they’re winning, while your stuck knee-deep in the swamp, you can take perhaps the greatest piece of wisdom out of Chase Jarvis’ Creative Calling. 

He writes about the skate culture he grew up around, “Nailing an ollie is essential for doing more advanced tricks, so if you can’t learn it you’re stuck. Luckily for me, it was easy to ask for help in a community like that one. … There’s a sense that when one person succeeds, the whole community wins together.”

And so it shouldn’t come as a surprise that maybe the best way to get over these toxic feelings is to feel buoyed by what is possible, that it isn’t zero sum. 

The freelance writer A.C. Shilton echoed this very sentiment saying:

Somebody else’s success does not really take away from your own. Yes, there are limited bylines, I should be using their success to push myself to be better. Right? So that doesn’t mean that I haven’t silenced the occasional person on Twitter who is winning at all things all the time and I need a break.

From Episode 171 of CNF.

It isn’t that somebody else had a win and you lost. It should be, ‘Oh, that person had a win, so that means I can too, so long as I work hard and maybe have a little luck on my side.’

And it echoes back to the skate culture: If you learn a new trick, we all win. So if you get that coveted by-line in The New York, we win as a result. 

Good on ya, friend, nice trick.

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